JEAN CASE:  Could you give me just a brief overview of your work with Amachi?  Where you are today, and how did you get started?

DR. GOODE:  The Amachi program actually was the birth child of Dr. John DiIulio from the University of Pennsylvania, and he persuaded the Pew Charitable Trust to fund it back in 1999 as a demonstration, and I came aboard in September 2000 only with a concept, not with anything at all done, but just an idea that people of faith and people from congregations throughout the city and in the country could, in fact, provide mentors for children with one or both parents in jail.

What came up was that on any given day, there are 7.3 million children with one or both parents either in jail under some type of federal or state supervision, and we have learned from a U.S. Senate report that 70 percent of those children are in jail themselves, and that these children are not only the most at-risk children in our society, but also the most invisible because many people, many faith organizations and others, went into prison, worked with the parents, worked with the prison officials around the inmate, but very little was done about the family, especially the children.

The idea was, essentially, to have a loving caring adult from a local faith based organization mentor a child for one hour at least once a week or two hours twice a month for at least one year.  In the fall and winter of 2000, we were able to recruit from 42 congregations in Philadelphia -- 550 volunteers who became the pioneers of the Amachi work.  They were matched with children, and over the next year, 500 of those 550 volunteers were, in fact, back with children.  Interesting, the length of the match was 24 months, and there are at least one third of those matches that are still matched today.

The program has grown since that time -- first, to New York with New York Big Brothers and Big Sisters, and then across the country, thanks in large part to the interest expressed by President George W. Bush who came to the City of Philadelphia and saw the program firsthand, not once, but twice, and I believe based upon what he saw and based upon his confidence, that it was a workable program, he initiated a process for federal funding for the program.  With the federal funding, the program has expanded to 41 places across the country, with more than 36,000 children who have been served.

JEAN:  It is really remarkable.  You know, one of the reasons we do these profiles is not only to focus on the excellent work of the leader, but also to bring spotlight to the issue the leader is addressing.  In our work with children and families who are disadvantaged, we see a lot of data, and it can become just that, but the first time I saw the numbers around children who have a parent incarcerated, the 7 million plus that you talked about, I was stopped in my tracks.  I think most Americans have no idea that nested within our communities are so many children who need their support.  So it's really terrific what you're doing.

The question I have for you is, communities of faith have been at the epicenter of so many social services in this country for a long time, but sometimes religion and faith is somewhat of a taboo subject to talk about.  How would you encourage more discussion about the potential of faith-based institutions to address our social issues, and what do you think needs to be done to make that work more effective nationwide, so we can reach more kids?

DR. GOODE:  Well, I believe that people of faith have a mandate by virtue of their faith and by virtue of their mission to work with those people, and especially children who are at risk in our society.  I think it's a matter of reminding the faith community of that mandate, and whether or not you are Christian or Jewish, Hindu, Muslim, whatever your religion is, in all of the instructions given by God to every religion, there is this mandate to take care of those who are on a margin, those folks who are marginalized in our society, those who are at risk, those who are most vulnerable in our society.

What I found when I went around and talked with the initial group of faith leaders here in the City of Philadelphia, reminding them of the plight of these children and then reminding them that most of these children live in the same zip code as their houses of worship, I just found that to be enlightening to them.

I found that they had not made a connection between those folks who sell drugs, those who rob and steal, and those who, in fact, kill and rape within those communities are really the children who we are talking about helping.  One of the ways to prevent this type of issue within the community is to work with these children when they are young, especially starting at the age of about 6, and mentor them.  And research shows that if that happens, they are going to turn out differently than if they had not been mentored.  So I think that the faith community has a mandate -- a mission, in fact -- to help these children, to work with these children, and produce something to assist them.

JEAN:  There is so much of an emphasis on the divisions of faith these days in the Muslim community, the Jewish community, the Christian community, but you are so right to point out that that is actually a beautiful connection we all share, that all faiths have that mandate, that calling.  As you have taken Amachi from Philadelphia out across the nation, what have been some of your major barriers, and for people interested in playing some role in this issue, what would you tell them?

DR. GOODE:  Well, I think the major barrier is reaching the faith leaders to tell them about the problem.  One a faith leader understands the problem, it is more likely that the faith leader will embrace this idea and want to help.  The challenge has been finding the mechanisms, finding a way to reach a large number of them on a one to one basis to explain this problem to them.  And I have to say that I just came back, in fact, at 3:00 this morning from Abilene, Texas, and just found an incredible response from the faith community there.  I had three events there, and every single event had more than expected, and these were all people of faith coming out to embrace this idea of working with the Amachi program there.

They called their program there "Ministry through Mentoring," and they made the connection, and they have been able to include the three universities within Abilene in this process.  Abilene is unique in its response, but there are many other communities across the country where faith leaders have stepped up and are beginning to help, and that growth is taking place.  We started in Philadelphia with 42.  We now have nearly 100 faith leaders involved in this program in the Philadelphia area.

JEAN:  Wow.

DR. GOODE:  And across the country, we have some 3,000 faith leaders involved in this work.

JEAN:  Does it really come down to you and the folks who work with you at Amachi going city by city, community by community, to get this train rolling?

DR. GOODE:  Well, actually, it's more fundamental than that.  In the end, it is one person talking to one faith leader, one on one, and explaining the problem to that person in the confines of an office.  It is very, very detailed work that needs to be done.  I have found that, although I have spoken at large conventions and conferences, the real work that gets done, gets done in five or 10 minutes in someone's office where you can say, "This is a problem that you ought to embrace because it relates directly to your community where you are living."  I have found that with that, the faith community responds.  So it means those who run these programs, spanning out across the country, faith institution by faith institution, talk with those faith leaders and really try to get the work done that way.

And 241 programs across the country have found a way to do that already, and 36,000 children and 36,000 volunteers have found a way to become involved in the program already do that.  Between Monday after Thanksgiving in 2000 until Martin Luther King's birthday in 2001, by myself, alone, I talked to 50 pastors.  Of 50 pastors, 42 of those said yes, and 42 of them provided volunteers to work on this program.  So I think that it is, without question, challenging and time consuming, but I teach, and the book I wrote says, "Take the time up front.  Go and talk with the faith leaders.  Recruit the volunteers first.  Get them done first, and then other things will flow from there."

JEAN:  So it must be interesting for you because you have held leadership positions in government, the military, faith based community, and local groups.  As you look back over your career, what has been easy and what has been hard?  How would you compare your role in the various sectors where you've made so many contributions?

DR. GOODE:  Well, I think that all of it has been fun.

JEAN:  Well, good.  That's a good life when that happens.

DR. GOODE:  I feel very fortunate and very blessed to have had the opportunity to do so many different things in my life, and all of them have been challenging, from serving as a chairman of the Pennsylvania Public Utility Commission to city managing director to mayor for two terms, then a deputy secretary for education.  All of those were challenging positions, but all of them brought with them their rewards and their frustrations.  But having said that, I would not trade any of it at all.  The experience that it gave to me has been just incredible, but it appears as if all of the work I have done made it possible for me to now do what I do.

I find that I can really pull upon and draw upon all of the experience I have had and really go into places.  People recall that I was mayor of a city.  To go into place and be able to see a problem that others will take maybe an hour to think through, I can just kind of look at it in a couple minutes and say, "Here's what we ought to do."  I just found that having been through what I have been through and having all the experience I've had, it helps me to do the work that I now do.  And of all the work I have done, I find what I now do the most satisfying.

JEAN:  A common element in a lot of your work and your experience, and what you have committed yourself to, is under served communities and individuals.  When you look either in Philadelphia today or across the nation and you read about the dropout rates, political disengagement to a certain level, juvenile detention rates, etc., do you stay hopeful, and are there bright spots you see that give you reason to be hopeful?

DR. GOODE:  Well, you know, every time I get frustrated or start to think this is never going to work out, along comes just a lot of examples of young people who have gone through so much and who just come to a point where, indeed, it gives me much hope.  An example is in Abilene, Texas, yesterday.  There was a young 11 year old whose father was in jail, who just had a wonderful spirit about her, who sang just a wonderful song a capella, and had such a wonderful outlook on life and basically said, "I do not want to be where my father is.  I want to be someone in life."  So I think as long as there are those seeds of hope that we can plant and nurture, I remain hopeful.  I remain hopeful because I know that if we can engage loving and caring adults with children who may not have any hope at this point, but who can be given hope by what we bore into them, I am very optimistic about the future.

JEAN:  So many children have challenges, but having a parent incarcerated must really add a burden.

DR. GOODE:  Well, what I have not said to you is that my father was incarcerated when I was 14 years old.  My mother took the four of us, four boys, and moved from the rural South to Philadelphia, and it was the pastor at my local church and his wife who became my mentors and became my "big brother" and "big sister" who encouraged me, who literally took me off the street and gave me what I needed in terms of nurturing, in terms of modeling, to send me off to Morgan State University, even when my counselor would not recommend me for college.  They just persisted and insisted that I go to college, and I graduated with high honors.

JEAN:  How did Amachi get its name?

DR. GOODE:  Amachi is a West African word that means "Who knows but what God has brought us through this child," and so I tell people all across the country who knows but what God could bring us through this son of an incarcerated father who left the rural South, with a father in jail, and went on to become mayor of the fourth largest city in the country.

JEAN:  You were named one of the first $100,000 winners of the Purpose Prize, which recognizes social innovators over 60, and your story is so unique, the idea that you earned a doctorate of ministry and became director of Amachi at an age when most people are considering retirement or cutting back on their schedules.  What keeps you going?  What made you commit to a whole new life again at this stage in your life?

DR. GOODE:  Well, there are three things.  One is my gratitude to God for having blessed me in such amazing ways, to give me so many wonderful opportunities, and two, the fact that when I was at a critical point in my life, two people in my church reached out for no reason, other than their love for me, and helped me to become who I am and who I became.  So that keeps me going.

And third, it was the compelling nature of the issue itself, when I learned about these children with a parent in jail and the likelihood of 70 percent of them going to prison themselves.  Then I went to a prison and saw a grandfather, a father, and a grandson in the same jail at the same time, and the grandson said to me when I was leaving, "I have a son that I have not seen.  I guess I'll see him in jail too."  All of those things came together to show me the compelling nature of this problem, and I am just obligated at this point to use all of my experience, all of the talent I have, and all the energy I have to do all I can to help rescue and help save as many children as I can.  I just feel that I am at a time in my life where I can take all my experience and do something creative and innovative to help children who, without my involvement, probably would not get that help.

JEAN:  Going back to a reason to be hopeful based on what you just said, if you think about boomers as innovators, do you think you are an exception, or do you come across others who are diving into new social innovations to address serious social issues of our time?

DR. GOODE:  Well, I think I'm in a small group of people, not a large group of people.  I think I'm in a small group of people across the country who, in fact, are engaged in innovative work, and what I am hopeful about is that the Purpose Prize itself will generate interest and will be an example of what others can do, what others can do in terms of changing, changing the society in which we live, that 62 or 65 or 70 needs not be a point of retirement, but a point of active engagement, a point of innovative thinking about how to use all the experiences over all those years, to help leave a living legacy of change in our society.

JEAN:  We think the Purpose Prize is a great idea, and it will be interesting to see what kind of role it ultimately plays, but I think it will definitely serve as an inspiration.  What else do you want to accomplish?

DR. GOODE:  My hope is that over the next five years there will be a group of people who will have a dedicated funding base that will help these children of the incarcerated, and I intend to spend the next three to five years going from state to state, trying to persuade the governors and the legislators to set up a dedicated fund source -- one half of 1 percent of the corrections budget in every state for prevention.  My point is, they can have 99.5 percent to incarcerate, but how about one half of 1 percent to stop incarceration from taking place in the first place?

JEAN:  That's a wonderful goal.  Thank you for everything that you're doing, and thanks for giving us this time this morning to chat.

DR. GOODE:  Thank you so much.  I appreciate it.